There is a Hollywood hype to what real love / true love feels like. It’s hyped as fireworks and big drama.
But it’s not.
Real love/healthy love is very quiet. In the beginning it just feels right…you know it without being knocked over For many years I beat the healthy drum and espoused the “build your own life” and live your But I had gone on lots of dates and had gotten to a place where I did know what I wanted and what I didn’t want. If I HADN’T taken it slow with others, if I hadn’t pushed back against living with someone else (who, incidentally, I had known over two years), if I hadn’t taken it SLOW and OBSERVED with my dates and relationships, I am pretty sure I would not have been AVAILABLE when Mr. Right came along.
Even though I had become known as being level-headed and my friends admired me for refusing to move in with Mr. Two Years, they STILL said, TWO WEEKS? Are you crazy? And me with all my abandonment issues and insecurity…what would happen when he “lost interest“? Would I go completely crazy and be saddled with another jerk? One of my biggest reasons for not moving in with Mr. Two Years was because I had a feeling that 1) the relationship was NOT going well and moving in was NOT the answer and 2) I would never get rid of him if we co-mingled our stuff. EGAD. Most people thought it was a well thought-out and wise decision not to move in with Mr. Two Years and now here I was getting engaged to Mr. Two Weeks. Was I CRAZY???? How could you KNOW this is the ONE?
Well we’re going to celebrate our 11th anniversary in November so I think we know. Actually I know that we know. And I’ve never had a moment of insecurity. I don’t talk about my marriage to brag or to say I’m better than everyone else or hey, look at us. I talk about my marriage so people know it’s possible…to recover from bad, VERY bad, relationships. To recover from low self-esteem and raging codependency and relationship horror. I was in very abusive relationships for a long time. Then I was in pretty bad relationships and then okay but not great and then good but not great…so I’ve been there…I’ve run the gamut….and I got to a place where I decided to be alone and live my life rather than put up with anything.
I talk about my relationship so that others know it is possible and know what it looks like. It’s something I wish for everyone.
When I met my husband, I knew who I was and what I wanted and he knew who he was and what he wanted.
We did not need another person to complete us. We were, thank you very much, complete on our own. Living nice lives and having a decent time without a partner.
Neither of us wanted all the crazymaking games we had both experienced with others. We both were raising our kids as single parents, trying to build a healthy life for said kids despite interference from nutty ex’s, and just trying to live our own lives.
We each had distanced ourselves from families of origin who were nutty in their own right but had tried to paint each of us as the black sheep.
When we met it was a matter of, “I know you.” because it was a mirror image: you are like me.. (but not totally)…
And I know YOU and I know you’ll be good for me because I KNOW ME and I know what I want and what I need and I recognize it when I see it.
When we met we were both very upfront about who we were, what we wanted, where we were going and the fact that our kids and their physical, mental and emotional well-beings were our first priority with our own health and sanity the second priority. Love and a relationship came a VERY distant third. We both had been dating without success but neither of us really cared that much about the lack of success. We would rather be alone than try to force something. We didn’t need each other, we wanted each other.
We both were working hard, going to work, tending to our homes and our kids…and we were both okay with that. When we met we each wanted to ONLY be with someone who would be a helper….not another child or another problem or crisis.
We became partners. True partners. Helping each other with kids and homes and life.
We both approach life the same way and value the same things. But we are very different people who like very different things. He likes fishing and Nascar, I like books and theater. He would be most comfortable in a boat on a deserted lake in Tennessee, I For all intents and purposes, we are opposite, opposite, opposite.
But we don’t sweat the small stuff and we are fiercely loyal to each other and our family. We both have the same morals and standards. Neither of us can be bothered having a round and round and round argument that lasts and lasts. We say it, we get it out there, we discuss it, we work out a solution and we move on. We have each other’s love and respect. Deep mutual respect for how much of a stand-up person the other person is. And we let each other have the space to be who we are.
When I first met him and he fell in love with me, I asked him what he loved about me and he said, “You are who you say you are.” If I asked him today what he loves about me, he would give me the same answer.
It was a quiet thing when I met him and knew he was the one. I just knew.
I knew because I had done my work and there was no noise clogging my ears. There was no unfinished business skewing my view. I wasn’t thinking it was one thing when it really was another. I was clear-headed and logical and didn’t lose my mind because I developed feelings for someone very quickly.
It was fun and exciting on one level but on another level it was just so quiet and so peaceful. I had NO nervousness, no anxiety…no insecurity and I am the QUEEN of abandonment issues (both real and perceived). I’ve never felt abandoned by him in 11 years. But I did work very hard on my abandonment issues for 9 years before I met him…the combination helped a great deal.
And yet, being with this person has helped my wildest dreams come true. Many people have all the fun times and fantasy times up front in the beginning and then spend the rest of the relationship wondering what the hell happened. They long for and are in love with the beginning which never comes again. For us, we didn’t build a fantasy out of the gate…we built our fantasies over time…
….for my first birthday with him, he asked me what I wanted for my birthday. I didn’t really answer him and he asked me to please think about it and let him know if there was something I always wanted. So I thought about it and I said I wanted to spend a night at the Plaza Hotel. It was something I had always wanted to do. He didn’t book a night at the room in the Plaza…he booked a 4 day weekend in a suite overlooking Central Park. We had the most glorious time. And even though he’s not a city person, he appreciates that I love it and he accompanies me to the city when he can.
We went back and got married at the Plaza…again spent 4 days in a suite. We went to Italy on our honeymoon and had a wonderful time. In our first year we bought new motorcycles and the first summer spent a glorious summer break tooling around Vermont staying at a romantic bed and breakfast and taking pictures of covered bridges and old cemetaries (we both love motorcycles, old things and photography).
We’ve biked all over the east coast and all over the west coast. Some of my best memories are us on motorcycles tooling around together.
BUT we didn’t START out having these fantasy weekends and then wondering when the honeymoon ended. We started out doing the nitty gritty, what Steven Levine calls “the terrible dailyness” and helping each other help the kids with life. THEN we took time out for ourselves and had a marvelous time.
Our fantasy days and nights came AFTER we settled into “wow you’re the one” and were a result of our easy kinship and partnership. A beautiful weekend is going to BE a beautiful weekend, it’s not going to be fraught with tension and unfinished business AND it wasn’t covering up problems either….and that is the stuff fantasies and fireworks are made of…and when we go back to our “normal” life, we’re not much different than we were on a fantasy weekend…we are who we are…and I have beautiful memories of us being us at home and in many different locales doing some great stuff…who we are as a couple doesn’t become different depending on where we are or who we are with…we are who we are and have been since day one.
I was head over heels in love but it wasn’t an out-of-body experience. It just felt good and right and comfortable. From day one. And it’s still good and right and comfortable. I don’t need good drama or bad drama. I don’t need drama at all.
I am a separate being and have never, from the beginning, spent time fantasizing about him or casting him in a light he doesn’t really deserve or earn…he is who he says he is and I have great memories of incredible trips but also great memories of him being by my side during difficult times and tough times…I think of him all the time but I’m a functioning and healthy person separate and apart from him and our relationship.
That’s how it works. It’s true love.
But it starts with you….always with you….finding true love starts with loving yourself….finding the right person starts with being the right person….so start today….
by it.
own life and know who you are. Then, as my friends will tell you, all of a sudden I met a guy and got engaged two weeks later and married less than 6 months later. People who knew me and women who followed my advice (both my friends and women who were in my groups) were convinced I had lost my mind. They asked, Weren’t we in the heady honeymoon period? How could we possibly know? I was the queen of take your time, figure it out, observe and figure out if you like them and not if they like you (as many of you regular readers know I STILL say that all the time.
am most comfortable in Manhattan. He’s a Red Sox fan, I’m a Yankee fan. He’s a dog person, I’m a cat person (but I took care of his dog and he took care of my cats). I’m a people person and he tends to be a loner.
It’s what matters to him…that I am who I say I am…and it still
matters to him. It’s a pretty good thing to value and he gets it every day (and some days he might not be crazy about it).
8/12 TFTD ~ More On Real Love
August 12, 2007 by Susan J. Elliott






I’m reading your old blogs looking for insight, and I just found a line that SO resonates: You wrote about your meeting your husband: “When we met it was a matter of, “I know you.” because it was a mirror image: you are like me.. (but not totally)… ”
Yes, I know this feeling. I met a man last year and this is how I felt. I couldn’t understand why I felt like I knew him and understood him. It really made little logical sense. True, we shared very similar childhood and young adult experiences, came from very similar dysfunctional families, and yet, we are really quite different, too. We share values, and I suspect we feel the same way about a lot of things, but we react to the world in pretty different ways. I cry for help and reach out, he withdraws. We both felt connected at a deep level. I thought, “This is good. I want to give this a real go.” After about a month, when I tried to move things forward a bit, he said he didn’t have those kinds of feelings for me.
It’s so very hard for me to wrap my head around his choice when I know we share this connection and an attraction and a friendship. I think I know when feelings are one-sided (although it’s possible I am just deluding myself). I’ve liked men before who I knew didn’t have romantic feelings for me. It’s a bummer, but you move on. But this, this is different. I feel like there is something there on his part, but that he doesn’t want to act on it, or even think about it. I feel like he pushes it away and then it creeps back and I feel like we totter right on the edge of something more, and then he’s gone again. It’s hard to know how to proceed. Sometimes I think I should just put my feelings for him in a drawer and close it. Move on. Then I think, I’ve never met anyone who I felt this connected to and how can I possibly walk away from that potential?
I know it’s hard. I had that connection with someone. And he just wasn’t in a place where he could act on it. His feelings for me would ebb and flow depending on a few things. One was his ex coming and going in his life. The other thing would be his work schedule. We would push and pull for about a year. In all of my relationships I never met anyone with whom I “clicked” like that. I swear we walked in rhythm, we would be across a room and both have the same reaction to someone speaking, we would crack a similar joke at the same time and we would laugh until we cried. We even liked a lot of the same obscure music and we even did the long walks on the beach (in October)…it was fun and romantic and wonderful and when he was feeling confused about his ex we were wonderful friends. And when she was out of the picture, we were “more” and then he would pull back. He was so special to me and I kept thinking he would see the specialness of our attraction and he wouldn’t or couldn’t.
The timing was bad. Very very bad. And I couldn’t MAKE him get it. He figured out that he wanted to be involved with someone after I finally said goodbye and got on with my life. And he met someone who was wonderful and married her. And later I met someone wonderful and married him.
It wasn’t meant to be and for whatever reason, he just didn’t get it in time to be gotten. I have no doubt that he loved me and cared about me, but he couldn’t value our magic moments the way I did. He either didn’t get it or wasn’t in a place in his life (very unresolved relationship with his ex) where he could truly welcome it.
Sometimes it’s hard to walk away, but when someone doesn’t get it or doesn’t value what you are together, that is what has to happen. Hard, I know, but necessary.
Thanks for responding. It is hard. I’m pretty sure he knows we have a special connection, because he’s acknowledged that. I think his fear of intimacy keeps him from being able to move forward with me and I don’t think he knows how to get past that right now. He’s never said, “never,” just that right now he doesn’t feel it. And, really, I can’t ask for him to be or feel anymore than he does, but, yes, it seems a crying shame because we are in many ways two peas in a pod. He just isn’t comfortable sharing a pod with anyone right now.
I really never got it when I was going through it. The guy I was with used to tell all his friends how happy I made him. He would sit with me and say how grateful he was that I was in his life. He would hug me goodbye and say, “I don’t know what I’d do without you.” His mixed messages drove me crazy. He would say that if he was in a place in his life (had more distance from his last relationship) for a relationship, it would absolutely be with me. We tried a few times and he just would start to “get confused” when his ex would show up. He had LOTS of unfinished business and he was not capable of a relationship at that time so I had to go NC and it was hard.
We didn’t talk for a long time (months) and then I saw him at a wedding. We gravitated toward each other as usual and were laughing and joking by the end of the evening.
It was like we had never been apart, the comfort level and enjoyment was off the charts. At the end of the evening, the dj played “I will always love you” and he pulled me out on the dance floor. We had NEVER danced before and hadn’t danced at all that night. He sang the song into my ear and held me close. Of course I was thinking he just wants to go to bed with me, but he wasn’t about that. He walked me to my room (we were both staying at the hotel), When we got to my door he just stood there holding me and said, “I am never so happy as when I am with you.” and he kissed me lightly and said goodnight.
The next morning there were about 20 of us who went to breakfast. He was there and gave me a little wave and blew a kiss across the room.
Did we get together? No. It took EVERYTHING I had to not call him up and say, “WHAT THE HELL IS WRONG WITH YOU???” I adored this guy. He was not ready for a relationship at that time and yet he met someone who would have been perfect for him. But he wasn’t emotionally available for it.
The next time I saw him was about 2 years later and he was with his future wife and I was with my then-serious boyfriend.
I need help with something. I don’t know if this subject really belongs
in the GPYB group or here, so I’m just putting it out here.
Here’s my situation, sorry if some of this is repeated information:
Early March, 2007, my then boyfriend and I broke up. We were
together for a year and a half; he lived in my home with
me and my 2 teens for about 7 months. We talked about
marriage, but once I started actually planning (after he moved in),
I got in touch with my doubts. I acknowledged the red flags
that I had been ignoring even before he moved in.
Fast forward to early July. I’ve done a heck of a job
of processing my grief and am beginning to feel better than
I’ve ever felt. I meet someone new and decide to test the waters.
We click. We share core values. We learn that since each of our
divorces about 10 years ago, we have both done counseling, spent
time on our own figuring some things out, and had some relationships that didn’t work out. We each finished our education,
established ourselves professionally, bought a house, raised our
kids (he has two grown daughters, my son is in college, my daughter
a junior in high school). We work through conflict openly and
with respect, as it comes up. There is a deep, mutual attraction
and admiration between us.
Fast forward to now, early January. We’ve been dating for 6 months.
This is hands down the best relationship I’ve ever had. This is
the man I want to commit to. I want to marry him. I know in my
gut that I have done enough practice dating and practice relationships
to know and trust myself on this. He’s the one. I don’t say this
lightly or without any fear at all. The disappointment of my last
breakup and other losses have certainly left their mark on
my mind and my heart. But love, hope and courage
far outweigh fear. (This is also the first time I’ve been in
a relationship where I could say THAT.)
We have agreed, based on previous life experiences, that we will not
live together unless we are engaged (with a wedding date set) or
already married. We would like to get engaged in the near future and get married this summer.
We waited for 4 months to bring him into the fold, so to speak.
The kids knew I was dating him, but he didn’t start spending time
with us on the nights and weekends the kids are here until I knew
it was a long-term thing. For a month or so he would come a couple of times a week and drive the hour back home at the end of the night.
Then I had surgery and he was my caretaker and spent a week here,
24/7. My son was away at college; my daughter was here some of
those days. After that (for the past month or so), he has
stayed usually one night/one day on my weekends with my daughter.
He and the kids get along fine. It’s naturally a distant
relationship b/c they are still getting to know each other–and
we are talking about teenagers here! Teenagers who really prefer
that their mom never date or remarry, at least until they are
older and don’t care anymore.
I have not had a revolving door policy since my divorce. The
kids have met and spent *some* time with a few boyfriends over the years, but my previous relationship was the first time another man ever spent the night, let alone lived with us.
So what’s the problem? I feel torn where my kids are concerned.
My breakup last March has a lot to do with this.
Not wanting to spring an engagement on them, I recently talked to
them about our (mine and my BF’s) plans. They were not happy.
They raised concerns like “You said you wanted to marry the last
guy, too.” It was a tough conversation that they did not want
to have, but stuck it out. It was hard not
to feel defensive, but I worked through it.
On one hand, I feel some residual guilt for having my previous
BF move in with us without having committed to a long-term
relationship with him. My kids had to adjust to that new person
in their lives and in their space and then he was gone. Not that
they minded him leaving; it was just another adjustment and on
some level a loss for them, too. And, of course, they knew the
breakup was painful for me. So I ask myself: is it selfish to introduce another serious relationship into their lives this soon after the last one ended? Is it selfish or inappropriate for any reason to move forward with an engagement and marriage in the next
6 months?
On the other hand, I know we don’t need permission from our kids to date again, fall in love or remarry. I believe that if I were to
wait for a “better time” for the kids for all of this to happen, that
time would either never come or it would come a long time from now,
when they are no longer ego-centric teenagers. (They’re GREAT kids,
just self-centered and territorial as all teens are.) So I ask
myself: Is it really fair to any of us for me to put this
relationship on hold until it feels right to them? How much of
this is their choice? How much power over this situation is it
healthy and fair to give them?
When my last relationship ended, I thought there was no way I
would get serious with someone again for at least 2 years, when
my daughter was in college and I couldn’t confuse or hurt or
inconvenience her so much. Even as my current relationship grew
more serious, I was holding onto the idea that I should wait
and we should maintain the commuter relationship until she
graduates. They say to go slowly with kids and new relationships,
anyway, so that was what I had in mind. But the truth is,
I don’t want to wait 2 years anymore. I’m not in a hurry–this
isn’t about desperation or fear of losing him. He would wait
for me. I think my beliefs about how and to what extent
I must “protect” my kids from potential loss and inconvenience
have changed. I don’t want to be selfish, but I also do not
want to be a martyr.
What am missing or not looking at closely enough?
Kathy, you say you have been seeing your current boyfriend for 6 months and you are both in the same situation (divorced and having gone through other similar things). Maybe your kids think that you are rushing things a bit and you could spend more time with him living together without marriage. The kids might be thinking that the desire to remarry is taking over the desire to find the right man for you and father for them. 6 months might be a lifetime for you due to the intensity of feelings between you and your boyfriend. But to your children who do not see him very often (he does not sleep over and is kept at distance) 6 months are just the beginning. Do you think postponing the marriage and moving in together instead would destabilize the relationship? (this could give your children the chance to appreciate your boyfriend and to really get to know him. it could also be a test of whether you can function harmoniously together as a couple and as a family of four)
maybe when they see how he treats you and cares about you, you would be spared the need to convince them.
Hi waterlilly,
Thank you for your comments. I think you are right that the kids feel rushed. I’m pretty sure, though, that they don’t like the idea of him living with us, either. It’s not just about marriage for them, I don’t think. I’m guessing that I haven’t given them the impression that I’m eager to remarry (in general) since I’ve avoided remarriage for so many years–but I could be wrong about this. It may be something to talk with them about.
I’ve been reflecting and journaling on this and, for now, I think they may be resisting this as a serious relationship PERIOD for a couple of reasons. One, they are very possibly feeling protective of me and themselves, since my last relationship (the only one they were really fully exposed to) ended only 4 months before this one began. (BTW,this is not a pattern for me to have one serious relationship follow closely on the heels of another.) Secondly, they really do like having me to themselves and they like coming to my house and not having to deal with a step-parent of any kind (their father has lived with a woman since a year after our divorce and they’ve never liked or fully accepted her.)
They did tell me that it’s not about my boyfriend and they do like him, they just don’t feel close to him yet. I think when we talked about the plans that my BF and I were thinking about, emotions got high pretty quickly and they didn’t hear much past the initial part of the conversation, which I understand, we just had to return to the subject a bit yesterday. I reassured them that we are still talking about things and there are many variables that have to be worked out and thought through before anyone moves in or gets married. I reassured them that they are and always will be my number one priority and that where ever I live and with whomever I live, their home will be there, with me. That will never change. I could literally see their relief.
As far as living together first, I’ve set a new boundary about this for myself that I feel is right and healthy for me at this time. That boundary is to not live together unless and until there’s a ring on my finger and a wedding date set, or until we are actually married. He and I both agree that in our years of divorcedom and dating–both of us having lived with one person in that time and dated a few others–we believe that we would not have moved in with someone or continued dating others beyond a certain time if we had more honestly assessed the relationship’s long-term possibilities earlier on. There’s a moment in all relationships, I now believe, when you reach an impasse and either keep trying (keep fooling yourself) or you take it to another level of commitment (whether marriage is involved or not, the connection gets deeper). In my last relationship, I went into denial at that crossroads. We kept talking about marriage, but did nothing about it. We moved in together. I started sort of planning and then sort of started changing my mind. I know myself well enough to know that if that BF had given me a ring and we had tried to set a date before we lived together, I would have changed my tune. I would have known on a deeper level that it was not the path I wanted to go down with that particular person. Living together, then, was a way to avoid the big question of marriage (delay it), mask my deeper feelings and concerns, and maintain the status quo (avoid the pain of breaking up). My current beau views commitment (engagement, living together, marriage) similarly. He knows he could not and would not go through with an engagement if he knew he could not marry me.
We don’t want to “play house” to see if we are meant to be together. I know myself well enough to know, for sure, that this is someone I will function well with as a couple, as a married couple. After my last breakup and all these years (especially 2007) of working on me, I just know. I wouldn’t even discuss the topic of marriage or long-term commitment with my kids if I didn’t know on this level. I think the issue of time might make people nervous for me, and I understand that, but time is not relevant when you know. It’s only a concern to me here because of the kids–if they need more time, that definitely matters. I just don’t need more time to know or trust myself. And this is important…that I finally DO trust myself to know and there will come a point where my kids are just going to have to trust me, too. I need to work out a compromise on where that point should be for all of us to be as on board with this as possible.
Thanks again for the feedback. Insight from others and the dialog is helpful!
Hi Kathy, that is something similar to what I said to you in the email group…I think that just respecting the kids’ comfort level without letting them dictate your plans is important. I do think that a lot of this can be smooth over with some time but the kids might be on a different timeline than you and they don’t want to be rushed. I think you are working toward the goal of everyone being on board very well. Tough stuff but you’re doing beautifully!!!
Susan, your input yesterday in the group was very helpful.
Sometimes I sit with things for awhile and process them internally, but there
comes a time when I just need to process “out loud” to reach a better understanding.
Yesterday (and still today) is one of those times. Many thanks for providing a safe,
healthy venue for doing this. :)
Okay….what is this email group and how do I sign up??? :)
Big purple button on the right hand column that says Yahoo groups . :)
How did Mr. Two Years handle the breakup? And I don’t ask this sarcastically, but sincerely.